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Philosophy with a minister
Archimago at 11-07-2013 5:08 am
I shot a commercial for a local church today. The minister makes one commercial a year that only runs during the holidays. It isn't a big client, but it isn't a particularly difficult client either.

While I was setting lights, we were making small talk. He asked about my religious views. I tried to sidestep. I told him that church doesn't really call to me.
He then told me that I don't have to put any faith in churches, but that I should trust in Jesus. It got a little uncomfortable, but I was nearly through setting the lights. We moved on to business.

We shot his commercial. One set-up with a wide and a tight. There were maybe 4 takes of each. It went quickly.

As I started packing the gear, he took another tack with me. He told me his life story, how he was a preacher's son that rebelled. He went to college and took philosophy courses. During one class, he had an epiphany that he was looking for answers that weren't really there and that he had a belief system that had worked for him until he had walked away. He returned to his faith.

He suggested that I open myself up to God. That a belief in Jesus Christ was the only real answer. That I already live by faith every day. I have faith that my brakes will work at the stoplight, but no concrete knowledge. I have faith that my job will be there, but no guarantee.

In the past, I may have followed one of two courses of action.
1. Confront him with why belief in things that have been tested to be true on a regular basis is far different than a belief in something that cannot be tested.
2. Mumble a halfhearted "I'll think about that".

The first course would be dangerous to my job. The second would be patronizing to a really nice man who has done me no harm.

I chose a third course. I thanked him. I told him that I knew he had other things waiting for him. They are in the middle of adding a storm shelter and handicap accessible restrooms.
This man that I spend an hour or so with once a year, gave up his time and tried to save me from what he believes to be a real danger. When he asked that I reconsider a faith in a higher power, he was really saying "I care for you and wish you well"

What's to hate about that?





Comments (8)

fuzmeister (The Real ST) says:
Interesting and mature perspective on this. At least he wasn't a total asshole about it like a lot of people are. People who are pushy generally have the opposite effect on someone they are intending to have. Also, it comes off as very rude and holier than thou.

I generally avoid talking about any kind spiritual beliefs with people who I'm not 100% comfortable with; it just always gets too messy.
David () says:
My problem is that religion motivates by fear. They all talk about how they're looking forward to paradise, but when they want to bring you into the fold it's the damnation of hell they're urging you to avoid.

Personally, whenever I explain my position (logically agnostic, philosophically atheist) I make it clear that I recognize their beliefs and the good it does for them, but why they're not and never will be for me.

All that being said, I think you handled your client well. He's in sales and you politely refused his product.
Archimago () says:
You say that your problem is that they motivate by fear. This guy never mentioned hell, but if he had done so, my reaction would likely be the same.
Why? Because selling Heaven or warning against Hell are 2 sides of the same coin. If one doesn't bother you, then logically, the other shouldn't either.

We motivate by fear all the time. When they get near the stove we say " Don't touch that, it's HOT!"
We don't say "Come over her and I'll give you a cookie"
If you see a friend stepping in front of a car, you say "LOOK OUT!"
You don't say "I'll give you a dollar if you step back on the curb."
To a believer, Heaven is a real reward. To invite someone is a kindness that deserves a "thank you, but no"
To a believer, Hell is a real danger. To warn someone is a kindness that deserves a "thank you, but no"

David () says:
Archimago said:
"...tried to save me from what he believes to be a real danger."

What's the real danger he was trying to save you from if not hell?

Selling heaven and warning hell are not on the same coin. The opposite sides of those coins are not heaven and not hell. If you're a Christian it's a dichotomy, if you're not it isn't.

As for your comments on motivating by fear, you put it better than I would:
"...belief in things that have been tested to be true on a regular basis is far different than a belief in something that cannot be tested. "

Finally, it seems to be your position that if someone's intent is kindness we should make every effort to avoid making them uncomfortable. I can believe myself to be doing them a kindness by freeing them from the shackles of an enormous cult, whose varying factions have multiple interpretations of the same source text, and use it to impose inconveniences or worse on a nominally free society. However I generally don't care how others live their lives as long as it doesn't have an effect on me, and I know that any persistent effort to "educate" those of a theological bent are going to result in someone getting offended. My true kindness is to not say anything at all if unprompted.

That's the kindness I want in return.
Archimago () says:
"it seems to be your position that if someone's intent is kindness we should make every effort to avoid making them uncomfortable."

That isn't my position at all.
My position is that we all have a choice in how we react to others. I wanted to share my choice. Rather than confront someone who meant no harm, I chose to accept his words as he intended them.
If he had been insulting towards me, my reaction would have been different. Had he preached hate, I would have shut him down.

His intent was kindness. His method was gentle. I returned kindness in a gentle way, and felt good about that decision all day.

Hell, I still feel good about it.
David () says:
You should feel good about it.

I think we just had a...conversation? About the topic of religion. On the internet. And we...didn't insult each other. High five.
Archimago () says:
High five? Really?!

Surely you know that in order to do a "high five" one must put their hand in the air.

A high five is just 2 nazis standing too close to each other.
No thank you!
David () says:
I believe you are referring the the heil five.
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